audio set-up for beginners [continued]

[jhnkvn]

I dislike powered subwoofers in a car is because -- they're expensive. In other words, given a certain budget, a purchased subwoofer driver thrown into a properly modeled DIY box will be better performance-wise.

A subwoofer's performance is highly dependent on its enclosure. The better you construct the enclosure, the better it performs. In home audio, why is an entry-level Velodyne Impact 10" subwoofer expensive at 21,000php? Because the box is very well-made -- it is internally braced, thicker MDF walls, better lacquer paint to be more aesthetically looking, etc.

Let me give you a more expensive example: Look at 13" JL Fathom subwoofers at 200,000php, the subwoofer drivers alone cost is at 30,000php.. the amplifier and DSP is probably at 50,000php.. so where's the remaining 120,000php? In the box. It's so well-designed that any bass you hear.. is just bass -- no rattles, no flexes, and just bass. In a space of 1.75cu.ft. it weighs 140 pounds. How's that for a 120,000php box?

So I'll give you these driver recommendations and find yourself an installer who can fabricate the box. I'll also give you the box dimensions.
- Infinity 860W (2,700php) * 0.6 cu.ft sealed box
- JBL GT5-12 (3,200php) * 1 cu.ft sealed box

The Infinity subwoofer is ridiculously compact. The JBL will be bigger.
The JBL will be more efficient in throwing bass. If you can spare the boot space, go for it.

If you don't like the above, get a slim-type subwoofer then. I won't recommend them but some people find it fits their needs.
---

Keep the Pioneer speakers.
Purchase a 4-channel amplifier.
- front 6.5" speakers to 2-channels
- subwoofer will be bridged on the 2-channels
6x9" coaxial speakers at the rear be connected to the head unit.

What amplifier should you get? Anything that fits your budget of around 10,000php. A JBL A604 should be around 6,000php if you want a same-brand setup (JBL and Infinity are sister companies). Your subwoofer + box cost will be <5,000php depending on how well-made your box is and I do suggest purchasing a lower-priced amplifier and using the rest for your labor and wiring expenses.

[striker2413]

n00b question sir jhnkvn, any sound quality output differences sa mga 4 channel amplifiers costing between 3k to 10k (especially on brands)?

[jhnkvn]

n00b question sir jhnkvn, any sound quality output differences sa mga 4 channel amplifiers costing between 3k to 10k (especially on brands)?

There will always be a sound quality difference. They're not built using the same components after all. However the question will always be: But can you 100% discern the difference?

See the difference when you ask differently? I've never really heard anybody who listened to my car KNOW what I'm running at the back if they're uninformed of my build.

Problema kasi in measuring sound quality of amplifiers is that there's no site that does it extensively and objectively. This is also the same reason why reading amplifier' technical sheets are utter crap too since paiba-iba ang testing methodologies nila unless they're CEA certified (standardized testing yun CEA).

My advice on choosing amplifier is that I look at just two things:
(1) Brand - brand is very important because the likes of JBL will not make an amplifier that will sound horribly. Nakakahiya naman sa kanila since it's their tradition -- their business lifeblood. It's like Jollibee introducing a food that is guaranteed to taste bad.. that won't really happen since they have their brand reputation on the line.

(2) Power. Because an amplifier's sole reason is to amplify signals. This is why I pay attention to the power -- because it gives you a glimpse of the amplifier's power supply section. Given 100W * 4 ohm, 150W * 2ohm versus 90W * 4 ohm, 180W * 2ohm, I will most definitely get the 90W * 4ohm because it outputs more total power.

But as long as your signal isn't distorted, it's hard to perceive amplifier differences given similar power and gain settings. Overall, your speaker selection and tuning will comprise 90% of what your final sound sounds like.

[tsingketz]

Mga sir, patulong nman aq regarding setting up my bmw e46. I have a 40k budget. I want lnc setup with longthrow bass sna. As of now i have 1din pioneer for hu, and now im planning to hav focal seps, amp and sub. What do u think about brands for the sub and amp? Advise nman sir para sa budget q na 40k on what good setup i can have. Tnx

[jhnkvn]

Mga sir, patulong nman aq regarding setting up my bmw e46. I have a 40k budget. I want lnc setup with longthrow bass sna. As of now i have 1din pioneer for hu, and now im planning to hav focal seps, amp and sub. What do u think about brands for the sub and amp? Advise nman sir para sa budget q na 40k on what good setup i can have. Tnx

First thing you need to do is assess your budget. 40,000php for the entire setup including speakers, labor, woodworks, wires, etc.? Or just for the speakers?

Loud and clear is easy -- you simply stick with high efficiency raw drivers (they're called "pro-audio" drivers used in PA systems and concert halls) and then you need a huge box for better efficiency too on the subwoofer.

Forget Focal, you're handling it the wrong and inefficient way. You should be looking at brands such as Cadence, Beyma, and Ciare. If you can spare the cash as it's a midrange level speaker, go for the Beyma directly since the secondhand market for them is there making reselling an easier task in the future. Ciare will be your end-all setup for most conventional people as the Italian speakers are pricey.

The amplifier, more power is better. If you can go for higher-efficiency Class D, that should be better as not to strain your electrical system.

The subwoofer depends on what you want. There's a difference between long-throw subwoofers and long-throw bass. A long-throw bass is simply bass that'll reach very far since the wavelengths are very long.. in other words, these are ported enclosures tuned lower than conventional (mga 28-32hz). Long-throw subwoofers are subwoofers with very good linear xmax or the one-way cone travel a subwoofer makes when reproducing a bass wave (kaya nga long "throw").

* I will not recommend long-throw subwoofers as they are typically expensive. Take my IDMax as an example.. it's a long-throw subwoofer but costs 23,000php. If you can't beat a subwoofer in linear travel, you beat it by numbers -- use inexpensive subwoofer drivers but use multiples of them.

[striker2413]

*sir jhnkvn

thanks boss!

[tsingketz]

40k for the entire setup. Sir, pa-advise nman.

Package 1: (pinaqoute q)
Focal seps ps165v
Sonus ecstatic amp
Focal p30 subs
Wiring and woodworks included

Package 2:
Focal seps v15
Ll amp 200x4
Dd 512 subs
Wiring and woodworks na dn

Alin ba mas ok? Or if may suggestion pa kau. salamat mga sir

[ronskiee]

Good pm po, newbie po ako. Saan po maganda magpa-sound set up, kotse ko po is Honda City 97. Magkno po kaya kailangang budget?

[tsingketz]

Please enlighten me more if what papasok sa budget q sir na 40k, either seps or raw, then amp then subs. Pasok kaya sir sa budget if mag 2 amps aq?

[jhnkvn]

40k for the entire setup. Sir, pa-advise nman.

Package 1: (pinaqoute q)
Focal seps ps165v
Sonus ecstatic amp
Focal p30 subs
Wiring and woodworks included

Package 2:
Focal seps v15
Ll amp 200x4
Dd 512 subs
Wiring and woodworks na dn

Alin ba mas ok? Or if may suggestion pa kau. salamat mga sir

Please enlighten me more if what papasok sa budget q sir na 40k, either seps or raw, then amp then subs. Pasok kaya sir sa budget if mag 2 amps aq?

I won't go for either. Anything that isn't a raw driver isn't what I will call a true LnC car. Raw drivers are designed from ground-up to be efficient in playing loud while typical speakers such as the recommended Focals are simply designed to be your everyday speaker.

Al speakers will play music naman -- question now is how loudly do you plan on listening? Since if your idea is outside listening, you don't go for expensive normal speakers since kayang kaya kita talunin dyan and I'm geared on the SQ side of things. What you do is that you go for multiple inexpensive speakers or you go the raw driver route. 2 sets of 5,000php speakers will always outperform your 12,000php Focal set in going loud.

When in doubt, do spend time muna to audition some systems so you know what you want before splurging your cash on purchases.

Lightning Lab reigns when it comes to budget LnC setups. I don't like them really from a sound-perspective then I don't like their brand at all -- they're all sell-sell-sell. Walang engineering at all. But you can take a look at them since they're affordable for those looking for entry-level LnC.

For Cadence, take a look at the CVL series of raw drivers. Also for 40k, I doubt you can purchase Beyma raw drivers if it's not a speaker-only budget.

Your subwoofer performance is highly dependent on your enclosure. For LnC setups, the box is always ported (can be a normal port, flare port, horn, whatever... they're still ported) and it's always big (>2.0 cu.ft. of internal space) for efficiency.

For your subwoofer driver, well... most subwoofers work on either sealed and ported configurations naman. There's only a few who are optimized for sealed-only or ported-only applications. You don't need expensive.. you just need a bigger cone. If you can't get a bigger cone, get multiple ones. If you can't get 15", get 2 12". To create bass, you need to move air this is why larger cone area = WAY better.